Thursday, January 13, 2011

I Saw This One Coming

About two years ago Thom Hartmann and Alex Jones were the guests on each others shows at the same time.  It was a two network, 1 hour simulcast.  When I heard the mix of opinions I thought, this is where it is.  Somewhere within the two views lies the truth.  One finds that our views may be so far to the left  that we agree with that person  on the  far right  This is a new political dynamic that I was sure would catch on.  Ralph Nader discusses this new voting block on of all places, Fox News.


  1. This clip is a great find. Thank you. The alliances that have been created on land use in Humboldt are exactly the same that Nader has found on a national level. Right and Left in agreement that big government and big business are equally untrustworthy. Both need to be brought down to manageable levels.

  2. Maybe we can get the serious stuff done and agree to disagree on the more petty things.

  3. You might like this, too, Tom: The Electric Tea Party Acid Test
    "This is a memo to America’s hippies:

    Tea Party values are hippie values.

    You heard me right. The Tea Party is the one social movement in contemporary America that can rightfully claim to be the ideological heir to the original hippie movement that started in the mid-’60s. And because of this, all current hippies and ex-hippies should support the Tea Party, and by extension Tea Party candidates...."
    and it goes on to explain WHY.

  4. I think the true hippies as always will only support the anti big corporate tea party folks. Not all hippies are engaged and not all tea party members understand what happens if we take all regulation off of Wall St. and corporations.

    You'll notice that Nader got cut off when he brought up international trade. That's a big topic where both sides are mostly in agreement and the center is way off base. How can a hippie compete with .50 cents a day for labor in third world markets? They can't and hopefully they won't stand for it.

    I think in the current political climate we will have to keep the two separate and as is while we try to find middle ground and agree on those things we can agree on.. There are after all many things to agree on.

    We just have to get over the perception one side has of the other of being racist and the other side being lazy. That's a broad brush and although there is some truth to that, they are not the majority.

    You and I Rose are an example of two opposites trying to find middle ground with the truth. We aren't the only ones trying to hash things out in a civil way.
    That's one of the things that does make this country great. We just have to stop letting other people divide us and take back our country from the corporatist, banksters and those that would destroy the American dream. Then we can sit down, have a beer and discuss the small crap like who can marry who, should we legalize pot, Is the president a natural born citizen and are we spending our tax dollars wisely.

    I know and respect people that are communists, John Birchers, Earth Firsters, vets and vets for peace, activists of many causes, blue collar working folks, service workers, civil servants, politicians, first responders and even corporate lawyers. If we ever put our petty differences aside there is no telling what we might accomplish. I have been building a talk radio station that is not like my competitors and heading down one clear path. On the contrary, it's all over the map. Like a roller coaster of ideas and opinions. I don't think anybody enjoys all the programming but there is stuff for almost anyone. It's like a city. People come and go and they are exposed to things while there that they might not otherwise know anything about. It isn't perfect, it's America and it is always changing.

    Lets tone down the rhetoric and take back this country, not back to the 1900's but back to our future. It's time to build that future. The challenge is ours.

  5. I am still digesting the link you posted Rose but I can see that they have the fascists and hippies on the opposite ends of the spectrum. This may really be a movement.

  6. Good interchange between you and Rose.
    You two are good examples of opposite views, but keeping the conversation civil.

    Kudos to both of you. I hope this kind of thing catches on everywhere.

  7. Principle in front of party.... go figure!

  8. Principles of the party in front of personal ambitions.

  9. Better said: Principles of the party in front of Principals of the Party.

  10. I want to get this country working again. This is a sign of hope. We have a long, long way to go.

    This is not the United States of International Corporations, it's the United States of America. Small businesses and jobs are the backbone of our economy. Putting people ahead of the East India Company is what led to the Boston Tea Party. It wasn't so much about taxation without representation as it was a large corporation being exempt from import duties that the small mom and pop importers had to pay in the harbor. England was behind this and when a corporation conspires with business over people you have fascism. This is happening again in today's world.
    The more people that figure this out, the bigger this alliance becomes.

    We have many of the solutions in this country but it is cheaper to outsource than to do the right thing for the planet, our people and future generations. China is starting to look like Pittsburg in the 1950's and it is un-stainable. China knows this and is working on solutions. We have been like a deer in headlights.

    It's time for us to act like Americans again and work together. There is not much time left to lead before we have to give in and become followers. That's never been our style. We don't have to let it happen.

  11. unsustainable not un stainable, that sounds like a carpet or religious reference.

  12. "I want to get this country working again. This is a sign of hope. We have a long, long way to go."

    I couldn't agree more. It is kinda funny that, present company excepted, the local right seems to get this idea and be more willing to talk and compromise than the local left.

    How do we go about starting a real dialog and finding real solutions before it's too late?

    I'm reminded of a post on Eric's blog that generally says the same thing. We have a window now to really make a difference. I'll try to find it and re post it here.

  13. Found it, though it is not quite as on target with your idea as I recalled. The general point is still the same. Feel free to delete if you feel I am simply cluttering up your page.

    From Eric's blog:

    "“But I suspect that Eric is right that there are plenty of developers who would just as soon see the current General Plan stay in effect as long as possible,”

    Probably true but have you looked around recently? There isn’t ANY development going on. With a little bit of common sense and compromise a middle of the road plan with needed protections for watersheds, sedimentation, and over development could be put in place before the economy rebounds enough to encourage new development.

    “But, losing elections is one of the risks of overreaching. And in my opinion the attempt to radically reduce the rights of small TPZ owners was a classic case of overreach.”

    Finally the light bulb goes on somewhere. If the far left had just been reasonable in their goals they could have achieved the overwhelming majority of what they wanted. Certainly they could have obtained an industrial timber zoning that would have ended development on timber company land which is around 80% of TPZ land. Now they will be lucky to get half of their goals and may well end up with nothing if they don’t pocket their ego’s and start trying to build some bridges. Further, now there a bunch of cocky rednecks that have discovered that they can win who will be much tougher to negotiate with than when they were perennial losers.

    The moderate and conservative wins this year are due entirely to the elitism and pomposity of the supposed progressives whose misguided attempt to shoot the moon has crashed and burned. The extremists have single handedly created an opposing political will and infrastructure where none previously existed simply by being unreasonable and overreaching. Now there are two choices, they can reject what happened by convincing themselves that their loss was caused by a simple failure to raise sufficient funds and craft a marketable and articulate message or they can acknowledge the reality that the public simply does not want the full measure of what they were selling. Some of it, you bet, but not the whole enchilada.

    All in all, a colossal fuck up, which can only be made worse, or better, dependant on whether we can nurture a mutual willingness to come together, mend some fences and find a middle ground or more likely put our heads down and butt each other until only one is standing. Do not think for a moment that our new but tenuous quasi-majority has not realized that in a scant eighteen months there is another round and that they need only one of the three seats available to slam the door and that two of those up for reelection were impaneled by minorities and all with only nominal or divided opposition. They have proven the capacity to raise the money, build the organization, and develop the candidates. Remember only one of three, look around, realistically how confident do you feel? Moreover, is that where any of us should really want to go?

    Under any circumstances compromise is not a bad thing, in the current situation one would think it the obvious choice. As I see it there is only a very small window of time for progress before the respective camps commit themselves to another battle where the environment and public good are again the causalities. Today’s political realities unfortunately make it difficult if not impossible to stop the momentum of a campaign once it begins."

  14. That post was close enough to what we're talking about here. It is a local example of the same thing.


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